The Grow Show: Business Growth Stories from the Frontlines

Saying No: Selecting the Right Clients for Your Business

• Scott Scully, Jeff Winters, Eric Watkins • Season 2 • Episode 69

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In this episode of the Grow Show, featuring Amanda Dinkelmann from Archford Capital, the hosts dive deep into the importance of learning to say no as part of their "50 for 50" segment. Scott Scully emphasizes that while it can be incredibly difficult, especially in challenging economic times, saying no to the wrong clients or opportunities is essential for the long-term health and focus of the business. 
The group discusses the consequences of taking on misaligned clients, including the strain it places on the team, the distraction from serving the right-fit customers, and the eventual pain of having to offboard those clients. They agree that it takes courage to fire clients that are not a good match, but it's a necessary step to ensure the business can thrive. 
The hosts share their own experiences and struggles with this issue, acknowledging that it's an ongoing challenge, but one that must be addressed to maintain a healthy, high-performing organization. The discussion provides valuable insights for business leaders on the importance of having the right processes in place to attract and retain the ideal clients, even if it means saying no to opportunities that don't align with the company's core strengths and values.

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Thanks for listening!

Eric Watkins:

Let's do it. Welcome back to the Grow show. I'm here with my partners in growth, Scotty, Jeff winners, and we have a special guest today. Yeah, we do. We have a special guest. We haven't done this in a while, and we are super excited. We have the Chief Marketing Officer for archford capital, Amanda Dinkelman, in the building, Amanda, welcome. Clap it up.

Unknown:

Thanks for having me.

Eric Watkins:

Absolutely Glad to have you on a professional, a professional, yeah, like on

Scott Scully:

the front lines, on the front lines, on

Eric Watkins:

the front line. Stuff happening? Yeah, we're gonna try to do more of this. And Amanda is the first one we've had in person in a while. So super excited to have her on a little background on Amanda. She's been in marketing for a long time, but she actually was a past client of sapper Consulting at a previous company. I believe the was it the chamberlain group? Yes. How was the service?

Unknown:

It was amazing. It

Eric Watkins:

was amazing.

Unknown:

We had an amazing key representative who was very talented, but we had a lot of success.

Jeff Winters:

That's awesome. Well, that's good to hear. As they say, it starts from the top. No, every company, especially when you have a great experience, starts at the top. And

Eric Watkins:

Jeff, did you start sapper consulting? How you gonna

Jeff Winters:

make me blush? But yes, now that you mention it, so thank you for that personal compliment.

Eric Watkins:

Yeah, that's, well, that's exciting. And we love having thank you for your partnership in the past, and excited about your your new venture taking on CMO at archford. And we're excited to have you share mining for growth goal. I don't just hand off my section to anybody. It has to be somebody, and she's a fellow east side of the river as well. Lives over in Moscow, over by me. So that's awesome. So today we start as we always start. We don't change the format. When we have guests, we stay in the format. And we got to see what's going on over in LinkedIn, because there's been a lot of commenting going it's heating up. There's more

Scott Scully:

lies than there have ever been, Sheriff, what say you

Jeff Winters:

is my sound effect started? Did it end? I got no headphones today so I can't hear oh, that is my own good news for us. First

Unknown:

of all, just

Jeff Winters:

to clarify, Eric, when you said east side of the river, people may not know which River, your Mississippi River? So in Illinois, that was, that was to your congress. We've got an international audience here, man, and sometimes we

Eric Watkins:

got to clarify east of the Nile,

Jeff Winters:

two truths and a lie from LinkedIn. It's a fun party game that we've adapted to a professional setting, really. Yeah, two truths and a lie, where each week, we're going through identifying things that people are saying on LinkedIn that are true and that you should run with and believe and things that are vicious lies. Lies today, our first truth comes from Matt Neuville. Matt newville, this is finance related. Is it finance or finance? Whatever you prefer. I like finance. Hot take. Vests are the blazer of the finance community. Vests are the blazer finance. You're the expert. Amanda. Tell us, is this? This is true,

Unknown:

right? Well, it is. It is a known, uh huh. It's a known staple in the wardrobe, especially on Fridays in the fall. Oh,

Eric Watkins:

oh fall. Fridays, vest best Fridays in

Jeff Winters:

the finance community. Yeah, I've seen this many times. I know in finance, Scott, have you seen this trend? I

Scott Scully:

Yes, I have. Yeah. I had this whole other thing going on in my head, like there should be vegetables. Word,

Jeff Winters:

no. Explain what that means. It's a

Scott Scully:

festival. Everyone wears fast,

Unknown:

oh, a vestibl festival, a vestibule, a

Eric Watkins:

festival. Count me out. No, I would not like to go to a festival. You're

Jeff Winters:

RSVPing. No to the vestibule. I'm not going to I

Scott Scully:

just bought a vest.

Eric Watkins:

Did you really when we golfed. Oh yeah, that looked good on you. Thank you. I'm not a vest guy. I can't pull it off.

Jeff Winters:

But a man, I mean, you would say that this has been a shift over time. Wouldn't you agree this is around a while. It's been around a while, but now,

Unknown:

yes, nothing's really changed. It's been it's here to stay. It's kind of a classic. It is a truth. I'm gonna say that this one's a truth. She declares

Scott Scully:

it's a truth. That's the truth, the truth from an

Eric Watkins:

expert, somebody that knows, I'm not sure if it's a truth or a lie, but we should invest to gate you. Like that. You like that. Oh

Jeff Winters:

boy. I don't like it. It's such a level it's hard to describe.

Scott Scully:

She had no idea what she was ridiculous.

Jeff Winters:

Boy, oh boy. That is really something, all right. Now, our second truth, a little longer, comes from Noah London, no show. Those paragraph, paragraph, paragraph. I'm sure every single person who either is or has been an SDR, a meeting setter, has just had a shiver go down their spine. There's genuinely nothing worse as an SDR than putting in tons spelled T, O, N, N, E, S, tons. I like that. I believe that's a European spelling. Can we check that of work into booking a meeting and then having them not show up? Here's how I've been keeping no show rate under 20% for the last couple months. So good tips. Send the calendar invite and get your prospect to accept on the call. We've talked about that here. Call message all meetings due to sit in a day in the morning just to double check key one here. Try to book meetings within a 10 day window for sure, and last qualify better on the call merch, make sure this is something the prospect actually wants to spend their time talking about. This is good tactics, good

Eric Watkins:

stuff. Yeah, the the number one thing is that first thing, getting the calendar invite accepted on the call, which can be a little awkward. I'm not gonna lie, I was. I did it a couple weeks ago, and it took me, I wish I could have gotten the calendar invite out sooner, but took me about three minutes. But you know what, the person showed up, and that's what matters. So take that little extra time. I think this is, this is good stuff. There's there's other things, and there's a million ways to do it, but a 20% no show rate, pretty damn good.

Scott Scully:

I love it. I'd add a couple of things. The main thing for us is scarcity, right? Like you got to get to this meeting, because we're talking about something that only one person will get within a couple of weeks. But 20% hard to beat. Yeah, good job.

Unknown:

I agree. I mean, these are all great points. And yeah, you know, 20% is pretty good, pretty good. I mean,

Jeff Winters:

you don't want a no show. Do you like the people, the partners, the sale? There's no they don't like no show. You want to keep that rate as low as possible. Hey, that is

Eric Watkins:

a truth. That is the truth. Give it one more. Ding, maybe one more. That's too many.

Jeff Winters:

And now we come to the LA, and before we do, man, are you a person that likes process?

Unknown:

Yes, you appreciate it necessary. It's

Jeff Winters:

necessary. You appreciate a good process Absolutely. And let me tell you who you're not going to appreciate, Ari, because Ari says, hot take. More process equals less trust. More process equals less Come on, Ari, that's the that's the post. More process equals less trust.

Eric Watkins:

That's all he said. No contest.

Jeff Winters:

Let people run wild, run free. Ari thinks. I think Ari thinks Ari

Scott Scully:

is going on the most wanted list.

Jeff Winters:

I can't tell you, it's never even the last name of the lies, no witness protection, yeah.

Eric Watkins:

Name me one wildly successful company that doesn't have process in place,

Scott Scully:

right? Can't do it. Can't do it.

Jeff Winters:

I mean, I mean, as a self proclaimed process lover, maybe I'm taking that to the extreme, liker of process. What do you think about something like that?

Unknown:

That's the Wild West. And I'm sure processes are so necessary. I mean, we all know to be able to scale grow, it has to it's got to be there. It's all going to be running the same show. We got

Jeff Winters:

to be running the same show as Eric would say. We all got to be reading off the same sheet of music.

Eric Watkins:

That's a great way to put it. Would I say that? And it wasn't sports and it wasn't sports? Yeah, have you said that? Have I said it? I

Jeff Winters:

don't think I said that twice today, by the way, that's our segment. Two Truths and

Eric Watkins:

a Lie. Two Truths and a Lie. Great job. Jeff, as always, made it. What do you think is he patrolling out there? Is he doing it's pretty

Unknown:

great. I really didn't know what was going to come out of this segment, and I really enjoyed it. It

Eric Watkins:

was good. Good job. Proud of you. Party Game, yeah,

Scott Scully:

she's in front of you. She, yeah, she, she, I'm kidding, you're the best LinkedIn shirt. Yeah,

Eric Watkins:

you're good. You're good. You're patrolling out there. You're doing a duty. And

Scott Scully:

I kind of like that. You going across the pond. You know, it's not just here in the US, yeah, tons hard looking worldwide.

Jeff Winters:

C, O, N, N, E, S, or, as Eric might say, across the river, or he

Scott Scully:

may say, across the river, Atlantic Ocean.

Eric Watkins:

Anyway, moving on the next section, we have our very own. Scotty, diving into 50 for 50. What do you have today for us? Scott

Scott Scully:

This is big. It's a big one, and it's the hardest, I think, out of all of our 50 for 50s, this is the hardest say no. You have to learn how to say no, and that is so hard, especially like in times like we're in. You know, the economic climate, the uncertainty of the election comes. Coming up. Clients are a little edgy. Prospects are delaying, right? And we've got sales numbers, and so we talk to that person that's willing to buy, but they are not the right fit, maybe financially, or maybe there's not a cultural fit or belief systems, but it's so hard. But we talk about this all the time. The minute we take that person that we know that we shouldn't partner up with, it's the first out the door, it's the first Yep. And in order to not do that, quite frankly, I think that you need to make sure that you have the right processes in place, so that you have enough new sales meetings, so that you have a choice right and you can bring on the clients that make sense for your business. But you got to think about this, and it's almost like I don't know what kind of process you need to put in place, and we haven't really figured this out, either, because we still, every month, might bring one or two people on that that don't necessarily make sense, and it's super hard if it's out of our wheelhouse, but just don't bring on the wrong client, because, quite frankly, then what happens? I'm sure you guys will have a lot to add, but you bring on the wrong client, maybe you don't have expertise in that area. It takes extra time, and you take time away from the clients that are a great fit, and then everybody's hurting. Yeah, right. So that is the topic. What do you all think?

Eric Watkins:

I think that is 100% spot on and very you said it in the beginning, very, very tough to do when you're staring down the barrel of a goal, but I can think back in my career, and I've never said once, man, I'm so glad we brought on that terrible client. Like those words have never and a terrible, you know, it's not always a personal or a behavior, it's just a fit type standpoint, but it always adds to a lot of pain and suffering for everyone involved, the people, the person that sold it, the person that's implementing it, the person that's fulfilling it, and it's something that we can continue, can continue to do a better job of. But you're, you hit on it, Scott, you're, you're taking away from the core of what you can do. You're getting away from the focus of what you're really, really good at. And it's tough to say no, especially, and we're a, you know, we're a big company. If you're starting out and you're a couple million dollars, you're probably saying yes to everybody, and you may be doing it at your you know, it may be hurting your business. So I think that's really good advice to give

Jeff Winters:

out, yeah and, and the next logical thought on this train is, well, you should also fire clients that aren't doing it for you right now, having clients that are, you know, and unfortunately, this happens disrespectful to your team members who are misaligned in terms of expectations, and they're never going to get realigned. You know, that's like, it's like dental pain, you know, Eric recently had a root canal. So it made me think of this amazing analogy. I

Eric Watkins:

was trying to keep that private. It hurt you for sharing that we've

Jeff Winters:

had to. HIPAA, yeah, it hurts bad for a little for a minute, but once, once it's done. Oh, it feels great, and you never regret it.

Eric Watkins:

You're not talking about my root canal. I'm talking about her, specifically your root heard before, during, after, it's never had a fire.

Jeff Winters:

Don't take clients. You shouldn't, and you're not gonna bat 1000 on that. So when you have clients that you wish you wouldn't have taken, have the courage to fire them. I think Manny, you had experiences in this realm, agree? Yes.

Unknown:

So I always like to follow. It's about, for me, attitude, do they have assets? Do we have the capabilities to serve them? And at the end of the day, you're right, you're going to spend more time, energy, money, trying to offboard them in the long run, and it just creates a lot of stress on the team. So

Jeff Winters:

yeah, stress on the team is interesting. Maybe you could expand on that, because that's a huge part of this.

Unknown:

Absolutely. I mean, when your team is not able to focus well because of distractions that are happening, because of clients, that takes away from them producing their best work, when when everyone's in alignment and able to focus, that's when you're able to produce your best work. Yeah,

Scott Scully:

and I bet your best clients are not arguing about your fees.

Unknown:

No, well, we no, they. We always like to see some of our best clients. We have amazing clients, but they are our advocates. They appreciate the value of the service, and they're. Helping share with their communities,

Scott Scully:

how we can help. I love that, like in what we do when, when we bring somebody on that knows how hard, yeah, the work is, and they appreciate it from the get go, that's that's awesome, hard to find, but that's just the makings of a long term partnership. For sure, for sure.

Eric Watkins:

Awesome. Well, Scott, great. 50 for 50. Say no. As hard as it is, you need to say no, and then Jeff, adding in a his own version of it. May need to fire some people. Yeah, sort of two sides of the same coin. Do you want to get fired as a client? That doesn't sound great. I've

Jeff Winters:

never, I will say I've proudly never had a root canal or been fired as a client.

Eric Watkins:

We're proud of you. Thank you. Proud of you. All right. Sentimental for me. I'm passing over my section to Amanda mining for growth gold. What do you have for us today. Amanda, hold on.

Scott Scully:

There's all kinds of new listeners.

Eric Watkins:

It's hard to hear, but you can hear it the door. 1000s of people just tuned just tuned in. Yeah, yeah, yeah, finally, finally, finally.

Unknown:

Well, thank you for this opportunity. I've got some shoes to fill. Quite those shoes to fill, so

Eric Watkins:

you're actually safe in that regard. Yeah,

Unknown:

all right. So looking at ideas for mining that growth gold, I believe in lead gen it is, it is essential today in the digital marketing age, and looking for new ways to differentiate. But really, I like to kind of go back to the basics. It's about messaging, about connecting. I mean, you all do it really well here, being able to speak to that lead, interrupt them, and just be able to capture them based on what their needs are. How do how do you connect when you don't know this individual, this company. So for us in the financial industry, we like to be able to provide advice beyond investing. So how do you do that? If you know you're just trying to attract them. They don't know who you are. They don't have that awareness. Once you've we're gonna assume we've surpassed the awareness stage. But when we go out to attract clients, I like to position campaigns that are looking at. So I utilize the life events. So life events where money's in motion, for us is a key factor in the financial industry. So when money's in motion, it could be retirement, it could be starting a business, selling a business, selling a business, helping business owners. It could be marriage, new job, all these factors into your financial, financial journey. So helping provide advice for those is a no brainer. It helps build trust, but then also where what's really interesting is providing advice for age based milestones. So there's a number of them, but actually some of the more I find it interesting. Our clients are more interested in some of the younger age based advice. So say, for instance, they've had a child, grandchild, turning 14. That's the working age. What do they need to do in order to get a job? You know, the Working Papers, all that fun stuff. So those are ways to connect, also attract and share content that could potentially create a new client, create a new relationship. I love that.

Eric Watkins:

Yeah, that's, that's good, you know, the, I think the what it shows is you, you all in your industry, and I know it's, it's very different from what, what we're doing and who we're going after, but just shows you have a pulse on your market, right? And the fact that the what really stuck out to me was the they're actually more interested in advice for their grandkids or their children or whatever than actually themselves. And you could see how many companies in your same spot might just be beating them down with advice of what they should do and how they should invest and just missing out on that value. I think

Jeff Winters:

we could do a better job here. I'm inspired by what she said in that Eric, to your point clear, like knowing that knowing the customer, to the extent that you'd say, you know, the age based milestones that you would think on the surface are important aren't as important as something that I never would have thought of. Sure, and I bet there's stuff like that for our clients. I bet there's stuff like that for our listeners, clients where, if you haven't really dug in and listened and surveyed and asked them in a while, maybe it's changed. Maybe what people want to hear about has changed. I feel like I read the same stuff on lead gen this year as I read four years ago. And I wonder is, what's the what's the unlock there and finding the nuggets that people really want to hear about? Right, that wouldn't meet the eye, or

Unknown:

that aren't talked about. I mean, it's so easy to talk about retirement age and Social Security and all these things qualified charitable distributions. You know, we hear that there's so much information out there, and there's so many, you know, advisors speaking about that. But you know, what do you need to know? When your child turns 18, or for age of majority or healthcare, they turn 26 you know what? Certain situations just sharing information that's just going to be really timely in a way to build trust? Yeah, yeah,

Eric Watkins:

that's great. I

Scott Scully:

love it. I have so many thoughts just about it's just about providing value, right? You're in a competitive business there. I know you've got best practices and things that probably set you apart, but to a lot of people, you may seem like you're just doing what other people do, just like us, right? Yeah, but if you provide value that sometimes isn't even related to what you're doing, that's different than the other people.

Eric Watkins:

Yeah, that's great. Great job. Amanda, thank you. Crushed it. I appreciate it. Talk

Jeff Winters:

about providing value. Yeah,

Eric Watkins:

she might, you might have just earned yourself a spot on the gross show. I may have lost one.

Scott Scully:

I think we might have not let her get a couple of her ideas out, though, more I think she has more fire on the page. Do

Eric Watkins:

you have some more fire you want to give us?

Unknown:

Well, all right, let's see her. Well, I've got a long list of all the different milestones, but at the end of the day, it's just

Jeff Winters:

about providing value. Yeah, I love it. Give us one more milestone. I want to hear one so,

Unknown:

I mean, it could be anything. So if you're looking at life events, it could be caring for your aging parents. Well, that's something. New job, new home, Medicare, full age retirement, you know all those fun ones. We've got health. We've got catch up contributions when you turn the age of 50, you're we've got Medicare when you turn 65 full retirement age required, minimum distributions, all those fun things. I

Jeff Winters:

hate to do this to you, because you're the expert, but you are missing one there. Which one? Youth select sports. Oh,

Unknown:

that's such an important one.

Jeff Winters:

Youth

Eric Watkins:

select sports. Huge financial investment

Unknown:

is moving

Scott Scully:

buckets of cash to be able to hit. Oh, yeah, you

Jeff Winters:

should have a 529, for youth select sports, $4,000 a year for Timmy to shoot on a seven foot basket.

Eric Watkins:

Yes, yeah, you select sports, okay? Well, you don't always have to take Jeff's advice. We don't need to put that on some list. Yeah, most, mostly, we don't. We don't take

Scott Scully:

it. They were on the edge of their seats and you just canceled the sorry,

Eric Watkins:

yeah. Well, now we unfortunately have to listen to Jeff's advice again for tales from sales.

Unknown:

It's hard to follow her slow

Eric Watkins:

on the button today. Tell me when it's when the sound effects. Brian, little slow on the button over there. Man, I think he fell asleep.

Scott Scully:

How intimidated are you right now when we've got a growth guest that is clearly better than you are at providing advice? Absolutely,

Jeff Winters:

she's better at providing advice and just provided advice about providing advice also better, and I spoiled it with youth select sports. Tales from sales this week is a dramatic two parter. Dramatic two parter. So you all will have your option in terms of my tip, because one tip, well, I'll tell you all about so first for sales leaders, you need to make sure that you are taking sales calls from other companies. You need to make sure that you are taking sales calls from other companies even if you don't want to, even if you don't want to, because you have to stay sharp. You have to hear what other people are doing, other sales organizations are doing. You can adapt best practices and every now and again, Eric, something you're doing when you hear it done to you hits your ear. Real weird. Yeah. And that is the experience that I had on a sales call the other day. I was prospected expertly, by the way, I took the call because the prospecting was so expert. And we got on the call, and he goes, Jeff, thanks for coming. Tell me what prompted you to want to take this meeting. And I know that we say that, I know that we're supposed to say that. I know that the world has told us what prompted you to you know it prompted me to take this email me 400 times, and it just put me in I was so off put by that what prompted you to want to meet with me? It's like, Come on, don't do that. And that is, that is something I have taught people to do. And by the way, to Scott's credit, he said, Don't do that. I taught people, I have taught people to do this. And it hit my ear, so Oh, I was so off put it was really hard to continue. He ended up being great, and the company's awesome, but starting a meeting that way sounds good intellectually. Sounds smart. I've read it on. LinkedIn, a million times. We all have it cringed me so those are my two tips, one inside the other. It's like a, it's like a, what do they call the hot dog with the puff pastry, a pig in a blanket. It's like, this is like a pig in a blanket.

Eric Watkins:

Which one's the pig? Which one's the blanket?

Jeff Winters:

Don't quiz me. Okay,

Eric Watkins:

I agree with this completely. I feel like, especially if you're using cold call as a channel and you show up to a meeting, what prompted you to take this meeting? Well, you called me a million times and convinced me to meet with you. Pull them in right at the beginning of the call, make them feel warm and fuzzy. This is why I'm so excited to talk to you today, and thank you for your time. And and then you can get to, what are the questions you have, and a little bit of the discovery, I hate that I'm glad you, uh, came around.

Scott Scully:

What would you say

Jeff Winters:

in what, In what respect,

Scott Scully:

when someone got on the call?

Jeff Winters:

I i always say the same thing, which is, I used to say that. But now I always say the same thing, which is, Hey, Scott, Thanks for Thanks for joining. I do a little small talk. Generally. Try to avoid, like weather small talk, but anything else. And I'll say, hey, look, you know, in terms of an agenda for today. And then I'll set the agenda. I'll go right into that. And my first agenda item is, I want to give you 90 seconds on us just share a little bit about us. Make sure you're in the right Zoom Room, and then I'd love to hear a little more about you and get into it from there. So that is my stock way that I go through a call. Do you do otherwise?

Scott Scully:

I like it, yeah, yeah. I especially like the giving them a little bit about you so you can earn the right to have them so they want to listen. I like it.

Unknown:

I love well, I'll always start with small talk. I don't give a lot of cold calls personally, but I am very critical. When I am on a call I'm taking, well, when you're being sold, I'm on it. Yes, thank you. I'm extremely critical. However, you know, I think the best ones that I've had were they humanize the conversation. You want to talk to a human. You want to be able to connect in some way. And you know, I understand you've got to spill, you've got to hit all your objectives. But let's also enjoy this five minutes that we're on the call and get to know each other just a little bit and then hear what the pitch is.

Jeff Winters:

So, but as So, as a buyer, would you have been? Would you be turned off, as I was with what prompted you to join this call? Or is that not? Yeah,

Unknown:

that's that's trying to put me out, you know, just trying to, well, put me on the spot a lot, right? Trying to, you know, and I'm never a fan of that, and

Jeff Winters:

I think I want to underscore highlight exclamation point, what she just said she didn't want to be put on the spot. Yeah, I don't want to be put on the spot. No, no one wants. Don't put anybody on the spot. Like, let's start off our relationship without you being aggressive toward me.

Eric Watkins:

Yeah, let's make sure you're in the right spot first. I

Unknown:

love the expectations. Set the expectations they understand what what we're going to talk about. Get their buy in. All right. Let's roll. So

Scott Scully:

should you know something about them as can the small talk be centered around some research that you've done. Saw you went to Miami of Ohio, or, Hey, you're over there and so and so. State are you? Okay? Yeah, you know, I know that. Like, how, how do you start the small talk.

Jeff Winters:

And what's your what's your small talk preference?

Unknown:

Well, some of the best emails I've received have made connections through Hey, I saw your alumni of the same school, or X, Y and Z, like, let's let's start on something that we have in common, or we have so that's always a really compelling way to earn trust right off the bat. Small talk. I do try to avoid the weather, but just what's going what's going well today, what's

Jeff Winters:

going well today? It is interesting. In the prospecting message that I was referring to that prompted the sales call. It was where I went to college. Yeah,

Scott Scully:

I like that, right? Could just be I like that live or any in emails,

Jeff Winters:

right? Wouldn't work for you, though your college is now, it's got a different name.

Scott Scully:

Is amazing. All they'd have to do is say, See, you're a maverick. Oh,

Jeff Winters:

dude, forget you're we're buying, if anyone is listening to this and they say that we're gonna buy your stuff,

Scott Scully:

yeah, right.

Eric Watkins:

You're a maverick from an undisclosed

Scott Scully:

kind of sort of state Maverick. And I'd be like, oh, there's someone smart. They

Eric Watkins:

figured it out school. They crack the code.

Scott Scully:

But I kind of could be as simple as that, right? Yeah, as long as that applies, yeah,

Eric Watkins:

I've I feel like maybe I'm in I'm definitely in the minority here, like I'm not a big small talk guy. I'm more about, like, I would love to have some small talk about my industry, like telling me, you know me, like, Hey, I've really excited to talk to you today. I've been talking to a lot of sales development companies, and excited to share some of the things that we're learning. Okay, what are some of those you know? And they're like, talk, chopping it up about that. But if they're like, Hey, how was Mizzou? Like, it's good, man, you don't know me. Let's what? What are we here today? But that's, that's just me. I know not everybody's like that. You

Unknown:

bring up a valid point. Knowing your audience, what are their core you know, how do they operate? What are their key characteristics? Are they dominant? You know, all the fun stuff.

Jeff Winters:

Good point. Yeah, well said, good stuff. You

Scott Scully:

wouldn't be that much fun to sell to.

Eric Watkins:

I'm not. I'm Unfortunately, not. I loosen up as it goes. He's like

Jeff Winters:

that at dinner, by the way, it's not like we're talking about dinner. He wants to talk about the stock market ordering, yeah, I'm ordering dinner. He's paying the check. Relax a little. Not paying the check. He doesn't do that, but he gets the check, at least.

Scott Scully:

He shares his items. Yeah,

Eric Watkins:

Jeff doesn't like to share his food, is what we found out here recently. You know, we're one team here To each their own. That is not the to do, to do or not to do for today. But that was a good one. Do you like to split your meals up? You got to, got to split it anyway for today. Thank you. Jeff tales from sales, that's good. Great advice around the horn. Great job. Great job. Everybody, especially Amanda. Amanda outshines you guys a little bit, but that's okay. That's what the guest is here. Question about that. So what everybody has been waiting for the final section to do or not, to do, do

Unknown:

or do not. The

Scott Scully:

manager. So you know, he thinks this section is way better than the others.

Eric Watkins:

This is where everybody comes from, or this way everybody comes to the show. This is why they come to the show for this section. Okay, so for today, I have something interesting that happened to me the other day, and that's where this story comes from. And this actually has to relate a lot with, you know, being close to Jeff and him talking to you a lot. So my question today is, when you have somebody that tells you a joke that they think is really funny, but it's not funny at all, do you do the fake laugh? Like, oh, yeah, that's funny. Oh, that's so funny. Or do you let them know? Like, are you honest with them? Do you just let them know? Of like, hey, you know i What else you got? Like, I don't think that one's that funny. So they don't just continue to go tell other people. Jeff, I'm gonna start with you. Since you are actually a culprit of bad joke,

Jeff Winters:

I think I tell funny jokes. Um, yeah, this is a great question. And I everyone deals with this. There is no human that is listening to this show that doesn't have to deal with this problem. And I it starts for me in the middle of the joke, because as soon as the middle of the joke hits, I'm getting uncomfortable, that it's gonna be bad, and so I just start laughing right in the middle. And I start laughing in always right in the middle, even though I don't know how long it is, I start the laugh till I get the I'm revving the engine of the laugh, and I am going to laugh at your joke. I'm gonna laugh at your joke. I am always because I like when people tell me jokes. I want to encourage you to tell me more jokes. It's hard to tell a joke a guy, obviously, provided it's appropriate. I'm gonna laugh at your joke, and I'm gonna start right in the middle.

Unknown:

Amanda.

Eric Watkins:

Amanda, what do you think? Guilty? Yeah,

Unknown:

I will laugh. I want the other person to feel good about their joke. I want to build their confidence. So yes, I love it's not funny whether it's the right thing to do or not. Well,

Eric Watkins:

oh, sorry, I cut her off. No, you're good whether it's the right thing to do or not. You're gonna give them the laugh. You're

Unknown:

gonna laugh you.

Scott Scully:

I think you left her. They were both nice, and you left her because you thought you were gonna come to me. I was gonna say that. I just wouldn't, yeah, that's what you're thinking, isn't it?

Unknown:

I don't know.

Scott Scully:

I'm I can't tell jokes to save my life, so I would have a little bit of heart for someone that was trying, because I can't even remember the joke usually. But I, I, I can't fake very well, so I don't know that. I don't know that I would be able to throw out the laugh if it

Eric Watkins:

wasn't funny. If it wasn't funny, what

Jeff Winters:

do you do? Polite smile,

Scott Scully:

probably. But I'm not, I'm probably not saying, if it was one of you guys, I'd say that joke. So Right? Like that was just really wasn't funny. Yeah. But I'm not sure I would do that to everyone. You

Eric Watkins:

know what it's it's interesting, because my situation, I'm thinking of, it wasn't, it wasn't really a joke, it was more of a story. But like, that's even, like, you're in there for the long haul, and like, by laughing, you actually encourage that person to continue with the story. So that was where I was, like, sort of, I was really I laughed, and kept going because, yeah, yeah, I was trying to, yeah, you know. And then it's like, you're just at that. It's a tough situation to be in. It's like, do you, do you egg it on a little bit? Or do you, like, kind of try to change the topic? Or, Oh, that's a great story. You've

Jeff Winters:

sort of, now you've crossed into another topic, which I, which I do feel obligated to address, which is the the quick funny story that's not quick or funny. I think that's what,

Eric Watkins:

yeah, that's, that's where it comes up, where, where this is seen most frequently. I

Jeff Winters:

have a quick funny story immediately I know it's neither. It's going to be long and boring.

Eric Watkins:

If you have to tell somebody that it's a funny story. It's not fun. Shorten

Jeff Winters:

your story up. Every story should be 50% as long. Yes, yes, man, do you like a nice, long, boring story is that

Unknown:

no one does.

Eric Watkins:

No one does. Well, you heard it here. You got to give a little chuckle. You gotta give a little chuckle. You can't, you know, don't be that person that's raining on somebody's parade if they think it's funny. But just maybe encourage them to not tell it again. You know, maybe, if you could do that in the politic way, that was a great Funny story, maybe don't tell anybody else that story. Don't ever say, Don't ever say, that's

Jeff Winters:

a tough that's a tough sell. Yeah, that's

Eric Watkins:

a tough sell. Um, thank you, Amanda, so much for joining today. It was a pleasure. And you know, we appreciate all of our listeners all over the world, all of them east of the Mississippi, west of the Nile for tuning in. We're here to help you on your journey to grow your business to $50 million so until next time, let's grow.

Jeff Winters:

Let's grow. Let's grow. So.

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Eric Watkins

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Jeff Winters

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Scott Scully

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